Post Halloween Post
Many bloggers have posted about the idiotic anti-Halloween comments made by Kimberly Daniels of CBN (Christian Broadcasting Network). Although, CBN has removed the article from their main web page, it can still be found here *
C.Woods over at My Thought are Free has a "few suggestions for those who believe demons may be in their Halloween treats."
It's a very entertaining & witty read for those of us who like a chuckle at the expense of religious foolery.
I was telling C. Woods about my own experience with Church & Halloween. I thought I'd share it with everyone as it also ties in with my reasons for liking philosophy so much.
Like I said in the last post, I've just signed up to one of the introductory philosophy classes.
Geoffrey Klempner recently responded to a question of mine about morals on his website & it made me realize how much of a part philosophy really does play in my life. I realized I've used it my whole life to "search for those necessary truths concerning the nature of reality"., as one definition of philosophy states in part.
I've always loved philosophy ever since I tried to read the philosophy books my parents had when they belonged to a book of the month club back in the 1960's. I was about 8 years old & was desperate for reading material as we lived an isolated existence in the mountains & didn't have a television, radio, or anything but a few books. I remember asking my dad what a particular book meant. It was a philosophy book, discourses of Plato I think, & I couldn't make heads or tails of it.
My Dad told me something to the effect that all the answers to everything were found in there. Which I found puzzling as my mother was very religious, & said all the answers to everything were found in the Bible.
Needless, to say I've been engaging in philosophical debate with myself ever since.
On to the church story...
One year during my sojourn as a born again christian, the local church I was a part of went on a anti-Halloween campaign. I dismissed their rant at the time, as I thought the church's rational was hysterical, & ignorant but forgivable. What I couldn't abide though, was the next year when the church got a different more liberal pastor w/kids, those same people who had stood up the year before & claimed to know Gods unyielding authority on the subject & felt it their duty to share it with the rest of us, as they waved their bibles around with all the proof inside, Those same people were celebrating the holiday as if none of what they'd said the year before had meant a thing!
& to top it off, no one else was bothered by that. My religious mother excused their insincere behavior by saying "I don't know what you are upset about, they are only human."
It didn't seem to bother her that they had turned every thing they had said the year before into a lie.
I was already falling away as church lingo goes, but that put me over the edge. Ignorance about truth is forgivable but insincerity is unpardonable.
What does that have to do with philosophy you ask? As Austin Cline replies to the question, "Why study philosophy?"
"...philosophizing makes up so much of what we do during life — there is no escaping it for anyone who want to think clearly or think about important subjects. So, we need to learn how to do it well."
The truth is if we want to call ourselves thinking beings, we will always confronted with situations that force us to look for philosophical solutions. In our personal life & our public life.
Most of you probably learned all of this out in school, but remember I'm unedjucated :) So you'll have to forgive me for rambling on.
*Hat tip to Stupid Evil Basturd


45 Comments:
C. Woods over at My Thought are Free has a "few suggestions for those who believe demons may be in their Halloween treats."
Never mind that -- how can I get one of those jobs at a candy factory performing Satanic rituals to cast the demons into the candy? It sounds like more fun than accounting.
Yeah. :)
How about trying your hand at being an apostle nut case? "Apostle" Kimberly Daniels is a nut case for sure, but it appears she has a flourishing Ministry.
A philosophy is a view of our place in the World. We can view ourselves as playing a large roll or a small role, as being empowered or as being un-empowered. My beliefs, to quote myself, are:
"As far as I can tell, Reality consists of three realms. The first is logic, followed by form, and then function. As individuals and material beings, our egos exist to the extent that our minds and bodies function. However, we are all a part of an even greater system of egos working together toward common goals, and yet competing against all the other egos whom are working against those goal which we have in common. Sometimes it is necessary to compromise with other egos, however that compromise shall end wherever those said goals differ."
....actually, I love the metaphorical punching in the face of people whom disbelieve in Free Will and in the existance of Ego.
We can view ourselves as playing a large roll
I view myself as playing a large Tootsie roll. The costume is uncomfortable, though.
How about trying your hand at being an apostle nut case? "Apostle" Kimberly Daniels is a nut case for sure, but it appears she has a flourishing Ministry.
Believe it or not, I've often thought about this. If Joseph Smith, David Koresh, etc. could do it, so could I. I've just never quite been able to make myself go through with the idea. I guess I'm not quite unethical enough to make it in the religion racket.
infidel
I consider you one of the most intellectually honest people I know. I couldn't imagine you compromising that unless you really believed it. If you ever did claim to be in league with the ruler of the universe, well I might believe you. :)
qf
Free will,hmmm...
Maybe when I get done with this philosophy course we can debate it like real philosophers. :)
What if I bring science into it though?
Science & philosophy are compatible. They are both looking for concrete truth in reality & they both have standards or proofs for determining that truth. Neither science or philosophy really accept belief, emotion or metaphysics```` as truth.
Good Morning Ms.Rita!
It's 5am here on the ranch(Dallas). Well ... what a touching and heart warming piece from Ms.Daniels on her expertise of demonology and deviltry, and my heart goes out to those who feel harmed or lost or prisoner's of these so called occultic practices. I am sure Ms.Daniels does well for herself looking at her $40/$50K smile and dentistry. And bless her heart for her effort's on saving these lost soul's from these clenches of "organized evil". But the bottom line is ...in 2009 ...assuming Ms.Daniels DOES LIVE in the 21st century. Most folks dont give a rats ass about Satan, or the Demonic world that simply celebrate Halloween...or care to worship a damn thing, nor feel enslaved by these Demon's of her's. They are simply having a little fun..and dressing up is all, and doing a little harmless socializing. Sound's to me that Ms.Daniels works harder than the demon's do and takes this more serious even ... and certainly makes a good living off these demons.
It is great Dear that you seem to have found something in these philosophy classes that appeal's to you... it is most important to please yourself and enjoy life, and to find what your heart seek's. Philosophy for me is self styled to my need's, as I feel everyone should do to their need's...what's work's well for me may not work well for another in other word's.I dont necessarily get all my philosophical influence from actual philosopher's.Every human that I touch or have contact with in life become's a part of me in a way .. to where after time... my philosophy is a reflection of all those and what I had learned about life through them and was able to utilize. In other word's even you Ms.Rita may be part of my philosophical inspiration in something or another I learn from you... or a philospher in a book or anyone else.... and I am a reflection of ya'll basically.... if that make's any sense?
Have a good un Ms.Rita! :)
One more thing I would like to point out to show the hypocrisy and condition of our religious and psychologically enslaved society.
Back several year's ago here in Dallas I was observing some of the private school's that were christian based elementary school's who decided to incorporate Halloween into school receational festivities since student's were BMB(bitching,moaning,and bellyaching) that they had to refrain from celebrating it such as other kid's in public school's were allowed to) Of coarse...this BMB-ing was handed to the parent's who pay the large tuition's(which they also get tax break's on later as well)to these educational institution's, the parent's started to pressure the school to loosen up a little (their the customer)...so these school's started celebrating it ...with all the candy,treat's,costume's .. some of which were even biblical character costuming(imagine that)but labeled the festivities something like "FallFest" (also occultic root's).What they done is basically took Halloween and converted it to a christian holiday using all the trapping's of traditional Halloween entertainment...and twisting the name's and so forth.Which they actually have quite a long history of doing...if you look at ALL holiday's celebrated by christian's...they clearly have all Pagan root's...saturnalia as christmas from ancient Roman ... to the folklore of these mythological archetype's coming to town on a sleigh back in ancient Greece, even the Nativity scene from Isis and Horus and the ancient Egyptian's ... the easter season and fertility pagan folklore,etc,etc...the list seem's endless.The christian's havent been "creative" at all actually...they simply took pagan holiday's and put their titles on them if you look at history. At the same time...instead of battling these devil's or what ever they call them...they joined them and became one's who capitalized off the same evil that they claim to be against.
Thanx .........
Neither science or philosophy really accept belief, emotion or metaphysics as truth.
Well, that is not quite right. I meant to say proof. & I suppose that could be disputed.
Ranch chimp
Ms.Daniels calls her self an apostle & a prophet. Heady credentials. I have been to those pentecostal churches that did exorcisms, etc...with my mom, when I was a kid. I've posted on it before. Pretty scary stuff if a person is impressionable.
Of course now I know it was just another dilemma to hone my budding philosophical skills on. ;)
I remember celebrating Halloween at church, with everyone dressing up as bible characters. I remember one imaginative teenager who got away with wearing a zombie costume he claimed he was Lazarus.
A few year's back a gal who I have occassional small chat with here in the neighborhood(dont really know well though) asked me the week of Halloween something like " Hey Tom ... watcha gonna be fer Halloween this year?.." I paused a moment and told her .."I reckon one of them High Priest's of one of them Satanic Cult's" ... she smiled and said ..."cool". :)
Later Ms.Rita! :)
I would like to point a couple other comment's here Ms.Rita.
Yes...I know you have had living experience from what I've read on these exorcism event's...and I havent.I have watched several on video that were performed over the year's though...and they can be intense for even a person like myself for that matter.I have no question that these folk's are having conflict's within, that can come about from a couple problem's in their live's...or a series of them.But when they are around an enviroment also to where they are taught/told that these inner conflict's that most human's have, (the only difference is the intensity of problem)are a "battle" of good/evil forces, they then believe that it is a demonic force that has taken over their mind and body...so when the exorcist does work to drive out the so called demon's...they naturally react with what they feel it should be like to react with a demon possessing them,it is cast out...and all the credit goes to the exorcist when in actuality if there was indeed any healing or change it actually came from the individual possessed believing now with the help of the exorcist/mediator that they were cleansed...now making them more focused on a healing process and going to the other side of the divide...if that make's any sense? This is why I dont believe in such concept's as right/left,good/evil, or any of the other...reckon I never did actually come to think of it...because as a child my dad taught me "balance"(what he called it) he said you have a "deep end" and a "clear end" deep meaning dark and clear being lighter in the mind...yet they both compliment each other, and the psyche was about maintaining balance simply.After my dad was released from captivity of the war from nazi's...he was in a mental institution for some time in America for problem's his mind went through before I was born from what I heard.But he was I reckon a philosophical mentor to me as well.He later became an addict to opiates and morphine which he had to challenge as well from his previous trauma.
Also I want to point out that there are people that join these satanic sect's/order's that do it with not intention of getting to know demon's or participate in ritual's and folklore, or anything spiritual at all.But simply join to support perhap's or align themselves with like minded individual's who are the adversary of organized religion's,I have met those who came from a religious upbringing of oppression...and just wanted to join just to be the opponent of what oppressed them.
You see...the word satan is ancient Hebrew for adversary/opponet.The CHURCH of organized religion say's their "opponent" is this devil/satan/belial or whoever name they pick ... so instead of conjuring some devil...they(satanist) instead take the title of the devil or satan as a form of rebellion ...not to oppose some spiritual diety of god...or perhap's jesus...but to oppose the ruling institution's that enslave our societies and systems. If that also makes any sense?
Thanx ...........
As someone who has actually studied the roots of Halloween, actually received a Christian education, sought a proper education on top of that, and was raised by a mental health nurse... I think she might be crazy. Probably dangerous too, to sane people of all religious/non-religious ways. At least the impressionable ones, and the ones who just want something to believe.
oooh, I looked at her website... she says she can help homosexuals. Maybe she can save me from being bi, or maybe she can spout more manipulative and blasphemous bullshit. There have always been worthless people like her. I try not to quote the Bible to refute things (unless I want to irritate someone), but I also like to keep things in context so let's just say, the Bible warns about people like her.
So does my mother.
Also, there are requirements to calling yourself an apostle... you must have been trained by Christ, and seen his physical body after the resurrection. (maybe she's telling us about vampires for a reason...)
I've said it many times, so I know you already know, but people like that upset me deeply, as a thinking person (though I won't claim to be a philosopher) and as someone who was raised in that religion in a mostly positive way.
Heh,heh,heh,heh,heh ...Reading Ms.Starry Lady's comment's of "she sez she can help homosexual's" "there have alway's been WORTHLESS PEOPLE like her" and "or maybe she can spout more manipulative and blasphemous BS". I must say I loved those comment's!
ranch chimp There is so much psychology involved in why we sometimes act the way we do or react the way we do & in the irrational ideas that people conjure up in their own minds. Religiosity creates a climate for crossing the boundry between what is sane & rational & what is not.
Sure, I understand why people might join satanic cults, it's prob. not that much diff. then why people join churches.
Hi Starry
I agree, people like Ms. Daniels can be dangerous, for one thing as an authority figure by endorsing this type of irrational thinking she is encouraging already unstable or impressionable people to cross that boundary that separates the sane & the insane.
As far as her state of mind, I have seen many Pentecostal preachers get carried away with the so called, "power of God" in the pulpit. They start to go with the flow or whatever you want to call it, & spout all kinds of weird nonsense. But, they are pandering to an audience that wants to hear it. I would just have to say there is a total lack of intellectual accountability & self control, all around in those situations.
I understand your response comment fully Ms.Rita.I wanted to comment on a couple term's there ...being satanic "cult" ... this is common to use this term...I even use it when joking around or talking about these christian satanist's, but technically there is no such thing as a satanic "cult" ... being that "cult" is a system of religious worship ...usually led be some leader...and has a set in stone system of practice,with of coarse the flock of follower's, devoted to this external diety of choosing by that group's leadership/ inner circle/upper echelon,etc. What is different to these that are satanist's ... is yes...they identify and call themselves the opponent's of these religion's...but they actually view themselves as individual god's/demon's themselve's, they worship themselves and friend's and the flesh...and self gratification...they sacrifice or offer nothing... and they think more like a wolf rather than a sheep. The ritual practices are thousand's because no two are alike, there is no system, no rules, boundaries,and nothing is mandatory ... basically...do thou will...but understand the consequences of your action's as well ... put it this way ... it certainly is NOT a system for everyone by any stretch of the definition.It also offer's NOTHING. You see most of all these religion's that I ever heard of...ALL offer something...even if it's just simple hope, and they all seem to offer some type of reward whether now or after you die. It is a mindset unlike any of these religion's...and the most individualist type imaginable.This is also why the reason's that one would join one of these sect's or order's is actually quite different.They are also very small in number's...and prefer to be that way...their individual ritual gathering's are VERY intense, and very tight knit ... very fleshly and materialistic...and far more animalistic than anything else, none of these group's even follow the other group's practices, each group whether it is of 5 people or 30 people design's everything for their individual personal need's. Just a little bit here that I wanted to add.
Thanx...........
For a clearer view of the mentality of contemporary satanism or the ideology or whatever...I would recommend a set of video's on YouTube of a christian minister and exorcist himself, by the name of Bob Larson...he interview's two spokesperson's for the Church of Satan...and drill's them on what it is about...and they are about as frank and straight to the point as you can get.Mr.Larson is an intelligent and reasonable man himself...although...yes...he does exorcism's and is a christian minister...but clearly understand's satanism well. I believe the name of it is "Exorcist interview's two satanist's" the satanist's are Nikolas Schreck and his other half Zeena LaVey.
I lost my temper a little bit there, fell into some name calling... but I don't take it back. I'm 23, I can be childish if I wanna ;)
Rita, the reason I decided on dangerous and manipulative rather than over-zealous (which I am also familiar with... I've seen normally sane reasonable people rolling on the church floor screaming gibberish, I am familiar with the faithful getting carried away) is related to things I read on her personal website... She reaches out not only to those desperate to believe, but she works specifically with undereducated inner city kids, giving her a unique position of influence in their lives. And the way she phrased things was very clever, but not Biblical (example, her efforts in pursuing an education have blessed her with certain degrees. I would have been pulled aside to have it explained to me that I didn't bless myself with anything, God blesses us, had I said something like that in the presence of the few Christian educators I've ever considered reasonable human beings.)
ok, getting carried away again. I'm not really a Christian anymore, I don't go to church and I stopped believing some of the basic church tenets... well, I could keep explaining, but it gets complicated. However, I have friends and family who are Christian, but not the crazy kind that upset me, and I don't like the image these others create for good people. No really, I'll stop now.
I'm all worked up about question 1 here in Maine, results will start to come in soon, so it's easy to get worked up over anything, ya know?
Ranch Chimp - is it just me, or does satanism sound a) kinda fun, since you get to do it your way, and b) very American?
Ms.Starry Lady .... :) Heh,heh,heh,heh,heh ...No ..I think that can be a fairly accurate description that some satanist's would have actually! I mean ...we love to enjoy ourselves, at least those of us on this ball of mud(Earth:dirt and water) that have the opportunity and enough freedom to, and it can be cross-cultural too ... however I think American satanist's like to take alot of credit for making it above ground...and they see American's as some of the best demon's in the world, after all ... all these other ragheaded bastard's such as in the middle east alway's call us the devil, reckon you might as well take some pride in it as well, heh? :)
You mention in some of your last comment's about reasonable people rolling around on the floor and screaming gibberish ...and familiar with the faithful getting carried away, ...is that what would kind of be called..."getting intoxicated with the Holy Spirit"? and if so...should that also be an offense if driving recklessly while listening to Gospel tunes? (just kiddin) Actually I know a little more about the christian religion...I just never been a christian is all.
Take Care.............
Satan...is it just me or does he look like an alien whom "fell to Earth" and crashed his flying saucer?
Mr.Flux ..I think that is a fairly accurate description on the fella actually...and he does look a tad shook up as well.Which is understandable.. I mean...what a horrifying experience it must be to crash land into a planet inhabited mostly by god loving type's ...heh?
I have heard many christian's over the year's comment on all kind's of thing's,doll's,even Ronald McDonald and other character's as being devil's too.Once I even heard that Santa Claus was another demonic archetype of some sort too.It appear's that some of these christian's may see devil's in their soup...certainly alot more than satanic folk's see it seem's.
ranch chimp I admit I have no experience with Satanism. It's just one of those things I never had an interest in exploring.
Starry "Influence" that's the key word. One influence Churches have is, they very actively reach out to the poor & destitute, i.e. vulnerable. It is charity for sure, & much appreciated but it is not without cost. Because it is also missionary work designed to bring people into the fold. When that fold means perpetrating ignorance & participating in active political involvement(like what happened w/your question 1 in Maine)It goes against our progression as a free thinking society. That is my opinion as a secular humanist.
qf
Weird link. I'd never heard of that big book. I'd like to actually see it.
Understood Ms.rita...I can assure you that I will never mention it again.This is why I refrain in most cases talking about many thing's ...accept if the subject may seem to be questioned and an opinion of sort seem's to be invited. I also want to point out that the individual's that I have spoken of here I DO NOT endorse or necessarily agree with them or any practice's they may participate in or condone.This has been a field that I had to work in,in the past and helped with advice to local law enforcement as well on these subject's.
Thank You and sincerly sorry for any inconvenience Ms.Rita .. or to any other's.
Rita: intriguing post on several levels. Philosophy is a great way to feed your head. Those who consider themselves "edjumacated" when they leave school and don't continue to seek learning are far more ignorant than you.
Infidel 753: "I guess I'm not quite unethical enough to make it in the religion racket."
Amen, Brother!
Ranch Chimp: "...they simply took pagan holiday's and put their titles on them if you look at history. At the same time...instead of battling these devil's or what ever they call them...they joined them and became one's who capitalized off the same evil that they claim to be against."
"We are the Christians. You will be assimilated. Resistance is futile"
Denial is not just a river, but it empties into the Hypocra Sea.
Ranch Chimp said, re. Satanists: "...but they actually view themselves as individual god's/demon's themselve's, they worship themselves and friend's and the flesh...and self gratification...they sacrifice or offer nothing... and they think more like a wolf rather than a sheep."
And that differs from the average mega-church leader how?
I once did a post on how mainstream religion differs from the accepted definition of "cult". To boil it down, they differ because they largely confine their cult activities to a back room, often called Sunday School.
And that differs from the average mega-church leader how?
Only because they admit it.
ranch chimp
Like I said:
I have no experience with Satanism. It's just one of those things I never had an interest in exploring.
I didn't mean it to be rude. I know you understand.
Maybe my exposure to concepts of Satan at church makes me shy away from the subject, but I can't figure why I'd want to involve myself with it. It just seems like entirely too much negativity.
You don't have to never talk about it again, though.
If you think about it breakerslion's & infidel's comments are worth pondering...
Having these blogging discussions is a way for all of us to learn from each other.
I have no experience with Satanism. It's just one of those things I never had an interest in exploring.
Satanism from 1966 to maybe 1990 was actually a worthwhile and interesting philosophy which had genuinely new ideas to offer. It was secular, hedonistic, and individualistic, but not at all humanist. It confronted Christianity and Christian moral ideas head-on instead of just ignoring them as atheism tends to do. I considered it not a religion but an anti-religion, related to religion the way a vaccine is related to a disease.
Then the neo-Nazis and serial-killer fetishists discovered it, took it over, and turned it into crap.
There's really nothing left there now which is worth exploring. Some of the older writings from before the crap might be of some interest, I suppose.
This comment has been removed by the author.
Ever noticed how every single religious book hates the Devil (the "Father of Lies") and yet all religious books have their own version of the truth that isn't even grounded in reality? The thing that all religions really hate the most is reality, especially whenever reality contradicts their own teachings which is almost all the time.
Haven't checked in for a while - so many comments to wade through. I always felt that comments are best kept to 100 words or less. Make me break into Evelyn Wood mode...
I understand, no big deal. I need a new subject, anyway. Sometimes comments have to be long to make a point.
Evelyn Wood...speed reading was one of the only things I ever excelled in at school. We did it in 4th grade. I was the best in the school.
I'm trying the robocaller solution. I'll let you know if it works.
I have asked Chocolate Jesus whether halloween is evil. I am still waiting for His response.
Chocolate Jesus sacrificed himself for you on Halloween. Isn't that enough?
I know it's been a long time.
I'm just overwhelmed by work. & beating up on religion is getting a little redundant.
I went to church today, lol.
"Dead batteries free of charge".....heh.....
Any cool new philosophies?
I'm sorry if I have offended you somehow Rita.
Don't worry about that! :)
Shit and I dressed up as Jesus last All Hallows Eve.
Now I don't know if that was demonic or sacrilegious or apostolistic?
One thing fer sure. You atheists are all go'n straight to hell!
Jesus loves me, yes I know. Cause I still got "Rock Star" hair and am good look'n.
Rita ?
Shit and I dressed up as Jesus last All Hallows Eve.
You have a friend named "Shit"? And both of you dressed up as Jesus?
Post a Comment
Subscribe to Post Comments [Atom]
<< Home