Exorcising Demons*

This post is prompted by a series of video clips on utube featuring illusionist Darren Brown. Chris Bradely at deeply blasphemous blog, brought them to my attention. The whole series is well worth watching but for this post I'm going to concentrate on the section on the laying on of hands because of that particular mixture of "magic, suggestion, psychology, misdirection and showmanship", as Darren Brown rightly calls it. This interests me because it is what I was exposed to growing up in the Pentecostal Church. This video is part 1 of 2 video clips on "Instant Conversion"
Part 2 can be found here. One thing I found interesting about Part 2, is in the beginning where Darren Brown, talks about people that got up & left the session because they were uncomfortable. I know full well that horrible, uncomfortable, wanting to get up & run out feeling, that people often get in pentecostal settings, but I never was quite sure what it was. My Mother explained to me when I was a kid that people that had uncomfortable feelings at these meetings were being convicted by the Holy Spirit or worse yet, possessed by demons that were reacting in fear to the Holy Spirit. Now I see it for what it was. It's a self preservation instinct.
Here is a video clip showing some scenes from an old documentary about Marjoe Gortner, a famous child evangelist, wherein he exposes the tricks of the evangelist trade.
This video clip brought back so many unpleasant memories from my childhood, as I was exposed to quite a few of these types of evangelistic meetings. In the beginning of the video Marjoe is explaining to the camera crew that is filming the documentary how they need to behave as not to expose the true purpose of filming.
To continue on the same theme... I am currently reading a book called "Influence: Science and Practice" by Robert B. Cialdini.** This book is about the psychology of compliance. He discusses six psychological principles that influence our tendency to comply with requests, they are, reciprocation, consistency, social proof, liking, authority, & scarcity. He talks about "compliance practitioners" for example, cult leaders, advertisers, & T.V. executives, to name a few, who use these principles because of their ability to: quote"produce a distinct kind of automatic, mindless, compliance from people, that is a willingness to say yes without thinking first."
I'm on chapter 4 titled, Social Proof.
Here is a quote from that chapter:
"The principle of social proof states that one important mean that people use to decide what to believe or how to act in a situation is to look at what other people are believing or doing there."
And also:
"Social proof is most influential under two conditions. The first is uncertainty, the second condition is similarity."
Since, I am knee deep in politics at the moment. I'm wondering how these principles(or as chapter 1 is titled, "Weapons of Influence") might be used to influence our votes? For example, are we being manipulated by politicians & others with a vested interest in our votes, perhaps by playing on our uncertainties, for one thing?
*I got this album cover titled, "Crying Demons" off Triniman's Blog from a post about bad album covers, here. It's really humorous.
**Warning: Read this book & you will probabaly never see some things quite the same way again.


23 Comments:
"The principle of social proof states that one important mean that people use to decide what to believe or how to act in a situation is to look at what other people are believing or doing there."
This is a natural consequence of our primate heritage, if you think about it.
For a monkey, ape, or primitive human, maintaining good relations with other members of one's social group is far more contributive to survival and reproductive success than being right about abstract issues is.
So natural selection has favored the development of an inborn tendency to go along with whatever the people around us are doing and thinking. This tendency is not irresistable -- we can defy it when something is important enough to us -- but it's always there.
Somebody tried to cast demons out of me once, but I didn't have a clue what Pastor Scott was trying to do, so I just stood there confused and he was dancing around acting like a maniac and talking about the Holy Spirit "coming onto me". It was craziness. Then he sort of did this whole "Oh, you've got strong muscles there" thing when he saw I wasn't playing his games because I didn't know how to.
Anyhow, that was such a crock and I should have never wasted my time with that college outreach ministry or whatever, save for the socializing and making new friends there....however, I'm convinced that the only difference between that group and a cult is that cult members kill themselves at the end, whereas this group just acted crazy and overly emotional and kept rambling on about the holy spirit.
infidel I have been looking for something about primate heritage, in the book. Although he does talk about automatic behavior patterns in humans & lower animals & what he see's as the differences, the particular subject of primate heritage is not brought up (yet anyway). The author does point out that automatic behavior patterns are valuable skills having to do with survival.
& yes, we don't have to be blindly obedient to these impulses.
Be aware of them.
One of the things I like about this book is, at the end of the chapters it gives you pointers on reducing susceptibility to having these principles not used against you.
qf So you are saying you still HAVE the demon, huh? I knew there was something odd about you.
talking about the Holy Spirit "coming onto me"
A phenomenon memorably depicted by Jack Chick.
I have a speed demon, and it likes to drive 135+ mph in a 65 mph zone.
interesting....
Why the fuck does everybody always accuse me of being evil or having evil motives!? I've just got this aura about me, and I can't quite rationalize it away or anything. I do feel evil. I feel like that guy who sold his soul to satan or something. But why, if I sold my soul to the devil, then aren't I a millionare yet!? I've always desired to do good in my life, and to be pious. In fact, I want to create something to make the world a better place. These feelings I'm having must be due to psychological conditions of having my parents always bribing me when I was growing up. It was always something simple, a deal type proposition or whatnot, stuff like how I'd get a better dinner if I took out the trash and mowed the lawn but that it'd be a regular dinner if I didn't. Over the years, it got to the point where they are nickle and diming me with bribes...."if you hook up the DVD player, I'll let you use the car to go buy us some beer" .... it's like my parents own me, still, because I've always allowed them to bribe me. None of my 3 other brothers ever took a bribe from them, and it would always end up in them getting knocked on the ground and then being sent to their rooms without dinner (except my oldest brother who could get away with murder if he wanted to, he went to parties and had friends over drinking underage all the time, but I wasn't even allowed to have friends by the time I got into high school because it would always end bad when they met my parents). I just always thought it was stubborn for my brothers not to take the bribes, but of course, they have a much higher self-esteem nowadays than I do.
There, I feel like a good person having gotten that one off my chest. No demons, just years of bad psychology here, that's all.
Hi vishesh
qf I was kidding about the demon thing, *sheesh*.
I was under the impression your parents were ultra religious.
No matter.Religious or not, parental influence can be awfully hard to shake off. I'm still puzzling out my childhood & my strained relationship with my mother. You think I would of figured it out by now.
As far as your siblings go...different personalities sometimes react totally different to their circumstances. That is certainly no ones fault. My mother had eight children, some fared better, like the ones that resisted her influence or that she ignored & some like me seemed to always be the target of her zealousness.
Of course the best way to get out from under a persons control is to get away from the person. Easier said then done, a lifetime habit is hard to break.
The most controlling parent ever has got to be John Stuart Mill's father, who Mill's talks about in his autobiography here
Well, like Marjoe said, most of the people that went to his church were having some serious psychological issues. Of course, it really sucks for Marjoe that he couldn't really help these people when he clearly wanted to. No, he had to act under the fascade of God. It's total BS! Nobody can have their problems solved by getting pushed over by Marjoe, and nobody actually has "demons" as per what that fascade that he was putting on was teaching. To me, pastors are misguided individuals who could do a lot more good had they became psychologists or motivational speakers instead of holy rollers that bounce around rambling on about the holy ghost and giving people false hope, illusions, and fears that aren't really all that beneficial to them.
Sorry about my reaction, but Marjoe is exactly right in that you can't solve problems caused by religion with more illusions and religion. Real problems just don't go away that easily, but they require much working on.
I have never been evangelized to but watching that video was pretty neat.
You read some of the more interesting books, or at the very least, you blog about what you are reading such that I can know about it.
I need your email so I can send you an invite. :-)
infidel Cute! I wonder how many Christian kids snickered over that one.
qf Real problems just don't go away that easily, but they require much working on. So true. I have to remind myself of that, occasionally.
Phil you've never been to a Pentecostal prayer meeting? It's quite an experience. Everybody ought to experience it at least once in their life.
Just another girl You can e-mail me at coquille58@aol.com
We have all the Catholics turning up in Sydney for World Youth Day shortly and they've just brought in their own magic dead guy in a box. Don't you just love these superstitious idiots.
Hahaha, it's could be a movie... Weekend at Saint Bernies!
I didn't get enough time to read it as it is 1 am in Hong Kong now. Shall look into it thoroughly later and share my thoughts.
Rich That is very funny! Not only a movie but a great idea for a pop-up book. ;]
Like Marjoe says, loosening up under the facade of Holiness, that sort of sums it up. and probably deep down we have that desire to believe, though we put on a radical facade.
But all this evangelism is a bit disturbing to see.
Take Care.
With Best Regards,
Srijith.
I think you don't know who Prash is -- he is nothing but the devil himself ! the evil spirit !
I am actually kinda lost reading the post. I think I should read the book you are reading to understand more.
shrijith unni Much better to have a desire to understand then to believe, I think.
prash I don't think I would never call you a devil or evil. Even if I met you in real life. You certainly don't look evil.
Basically, the post is about being bambozzled by our own human weaknesses. About how people like religious evangelists or any "compliance practitioners" manipulate us & get us to comply to their wishes, sometimes against better judgement. Actually, these people don't want you to think for yourself
good day to you...lol :) no post in a long time...wassup?
"Social proof" sounds like another label for the innate, instinctual inhibition against non-conformity in a group situation. This is why you could not follow your impulse and run from the icky faith healer with the insincere smile. Kids have good instincts on the whole, they haven't been completely taught to doubt and second-guess themselves.
I totally agree with you. I am not a religious person like you...i remember talking about this to you a long time ago in one of your old posts...don't remember which one now.
Don't get fooled by what you see...i look angel...but i am a little devil, myself ! ;-)
vishesh Sorry. real life concerns. Nothing major. Only it's Summer & soooo much to do.
Breakerslion said: Kids have good instincts on the whole, they haven't been completely taught to doubt and second-guess themselves.
& infidel said, "maintaining good relations with other members of one's social group is far more contributive to survival and reproductive success than being right about abstract issues is.
So in a sense, ones parents are the first of many of the "compliance practitioners" we will run across in our lives. But, it's not necessarily a bad instinct to follow the crowd when it is in our best interests.
Our best weapon against being manipulated is understanding the principle of social proof,
(From the book written by, Robert Cialdini: "The principle of social proof states we determine what is correct by what other people think is correct. It applies to the way we decide what constitutes correct behavior.
We view a behavior as correct in a given situation to the degree that we see others performing it.)
& realizing that others in the group are also looking to see what every body else is doing (this is called pluralistic ignorance).
If we can consider all of the above in ambiguous situations when we are uncertain...? we can guard ourselves against the manipulative influences of those who want us to blindly obey against our better interests, whether they are religious evangelists or any other type of snake oil salesperson.
Prash I find religion or lack of an interesting subject. Hopefully, I'm not too redundant on the subject.
You haven't changed much either. Such a flirt!
Post a Comment
Subscribe to Post Comments [Atom]
<< Home